by
Editorial
by Kelsey of Lifewithcoco2
Before going natural, I had never heard of a hair typing system. Everyone I knew had a perm and our hair pretty much did the same thing: bone straight when wet and puffed up at the roots when it was time for a new relaxer. When I decided to go natural, I stumbled upon a website that had a list of different hair types from 2a (being bone straight) until 4c (being kinky). It also listed different types of products that were suited to use for each hair type and how to generally take care of your hair.
In the beginning of my journey, I found the hair typing list to be quite helpful in regards to developing my own hair care regimen. Once I figured that out, I didn’t give hair typing a second thought. Soon after, I began to notice that I had 3 different hair types. Also, I learned just because someone with my similar, “hair type” used a certain product on their hair didn’t mean it would work for me.
As time went on, I noticed an underlying division in the natural hair community regarding the different hair types. I’ve observed those who are not natural are often hesitant to do so because of fear of having a “less desired“ hair type. From my understanding, part of going natural is to embrace who you are and love your natural self. It seems as if there are still certain beauty standards even within the natural hair community, which seem to be linked to the hair typing system.
What are your thoughts? Where did those standards come from? Do you think there are division in the natural hair community partially caused by the hair typing system? Do you benefit from the hair typing system?
About Kelsey: I’m Kelsey Janae aka Lifewithcoco2, I love all things natural hair. I seek to inspire and educate using my knowledge of all things hair, health, and beauty. My goal is to encourage women and men to always be the best version of themselves.
163 Responses
Yes! OMG I thought I was the only one that had noticed. I really canNOT wait for this “good hair/bad hair” mentality to melt away. There is division within the “natural hair community” and it needs to stop!
I don’t worry about the typing system it is just a way of grouping hair types. I would love to see the good hair/ bad hair mentality melt away. I don’t watch type 3 hair vloggers because they don’t have my hair, I love looking at type 4s because to me that is our hair. Simple as.
Yesss!
I say this a lot, but it’s not the hair typing system that causes discrimination, all it does is describe a type of hair. It’s not saying one hair type will acheive “prettier” results than another, that’s what people are saying.. It’s people that discriminate, not a chart. Eliminating it wouldn’t stop people from discriminating, would it. People would still favour one texture over another, because regardless of the presence of a label like 3b or 4c, different texture is always going to exist.
I think people are more obsessed with length more than anything.
Hair typing was unknown to me prior to my natural journey. I’ve actually been perm free for 14 years but it’s only been a year since incorporating natural healthy hair practices and products. I liked the typing chart because it helped me figure out what products were most beneficial. I hate that people use it differentiate good/bad. That’s stupid and goes against what it means to be natural. We are suppose to embrace what God gave us and love the beauty of it. European standards of beauty are ingrained in the psyche of what it seems is most people. I’m So glad that I reject that ridiculous standard. I love being ME all day everyday.
I don’t hate my shrinkage, it’s just a little difficult to deal with. For instances, it takes me 30 minutes for me to braid one braid. However, if blow dry my hair first it’s a lot easier to braid!!!!!
I think hair typin and loose patterns are overrated. I dont get what the fuss is all about. I dont stretch my hair and let it shrink its heart away
“shrink its heart away” very rare…personally I love shrinkage and I’m 4d…today type 4 hate their shrinkage…so sad
Friends who are “concious” naturals still got no clue about thesystem. On this sight i noticed that type 4b,bc and c get a lot more hype than loose haired style icons.
Besides, sans the system hair would be a helluva lot more confusin. Alotta naturals call their hair “thick” . Imagine researchin your “thick” hair
this is why i’m so over the natural hair movement. it truly was a fad and not based in acceptance of self. many went natural just to see if they had type 3 hair. the type 4s who stay natural obsess with curl definition and curl stretching styles.
just get a friggin texturizer and stop wasting $$$ looking for that oh so special product that will make your indie arie kinks turn to mya curls.
So true!
So what’s that saying about girls who wear weaves and get relaxers? U get a relaxer to stretch your hair so that it appears longer and you wear a weave so that your hair appears longer but you’re bashings type 4 hair for stretching their natural hair so it appears longer….lol sounds to me ure self hating, and u were the one who went natural to see if u had type 3 curls and I guess you didn’t so you resorted back to relaxers because you didn’t feel beautiful with the hair God gave you. I don’t blame you I blame the world’s definition of beauty I say if we all go natural it’s how God made us, and we were more together when we loved ourselves. Now with weave and relaxers black people are self haters. When all blacks were rocking their natural hair we stood together, now we are divided cause people like you who self hate because u believe you’re relaxed/texurized hair is better than your natural state. Its not a fad or movement it’s just some of us opened our eyes and began to love our beauty not adapt to European standards of beauty, proud to be black but you chemically alter one of the biggest African American traits ehh sounds like you’re the one with the problem. Remember your roots! And actually I spend less money now then when my hair was relaxed. Relaxed hair is a fad that needs to end stop I believe this will unite us as a race if we start loving yourself which will in turn means loving YOUR hair regardless of the texture!
This comment deserves more upvotes
I agree hair typing once I figured out my hair type (Thanks Ms. Felicia Leatherwood), I was able to search for things that were compatible for my hair. SO that was helpful, but its hurt full because as I was searching through the forums and even YouTube ( when I was starting my transitioning journey). All I saw was the Kinky Curlies getting made at the curly and wavies and visa-versa. Especially over kinky curlies going to the curlie wavies channels instead of theirs etc. we’ve all seen it and read it. The hair typing split us in a bad way. Then you have the war from the blacks and the mix. I was like DANG, its not about the dark’s vs the light skinned; we have now added hair to it! We all have different hair and textures and that is Bad Ass! So when people ask what’s my type I say multi-texured. I got all sorts of types running through my head. But even though I have a lot of textures I have had few products that wasn’t really meant for my hair, really do a awesome job and then the ones that where just… not. But those are the breaks. I don’t care what people’s hair type is. As long as they are cool and down to earth I’m good.
The hair typing system is incomplete in my opinion. If it was a 4b could watch another 4b’s tutorial and be able to duplicate the results. But that rarely happens. Green Beauty Channel came up with a 5 category system that covers all elements of hair: 1. Curl pattern 2. Texture (shrinkage) 3. Hair density 4. Thickness 5. Porosity. These 4 other elements of hair type explain the repeated failures of simply picking someone with the same number 4 and letter c and expecting the same results that they enjoy. So this quick and it has it’s moments typing system flaws have lead to frustration and failure and misunderstanding in the natural hair community. However I do not blame it for the discrimination against those with “4b” and higher textures. It is simply a misused tool in the hands or ignorant uniformed or straight out bigoted people. Do I blame the tool for that or who is USING the tool to express their biased beliefs? Before the typing system NAPPY and GOOD HAIR where used now 3b c and 4b c are used to do the same thing. SAME feelings Different words. Change comes not with new labels but with peoples MINDS!!
I think people should relax about the hair-typing system. I believe it only causes harm if you allow it. The system simple describes curl patterns and textures. Whether or not you ascribe to it is a personal preference. It is not the hair typing system that causes the issue because people’s hair is going to look, feel, and behave differently regardless. It varies, so what! I think is actually very helpful even it if does not paint the whole picture. Green Beauty Channel on YouTube is a great resource for true hair categorizing and how it helps you to care for your hair properly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwbzEcTH4qc Both of the images above are beautiful. If it grows out of your head it is God-given and it is divinely beautiful. Accept yourself!
Before I went natural as well, I had never heard of the hair typing system. The bottom line is that even if someone has the same texture or “type” as your hair, the products that they use may not work for you. I believe the hair typing system perhaps could have been seen as helpful when it was introduced, but now it is just another way for the black community to divide. #Yellowbone vs. #Darkskin, #kinkyhair vs. #curlyhair, #naturalhair vs. #straighthair. It’s all a bunch of never ending excuses to make useless divisions in my mind.
Hair discrimination is part of our history.When I was a kid, there was good hair/bad hair/light skin /dark skin issues,but back in the late 60s & 70s when I first went natural, there were few products & no hair typing at all. In fact the girls who had loose curls were trying to get theirs to kink up to get that Afro Sheen look. People with severe shrinkage would get blowout kits( really just a weak perm ) to get that big round afro. I’m a type 4 soft fine haired natural but all I had to do was braid mine up & take it out to get that look. That was fine with me because I’d sworn off all lye based products forever after a disastrous relaxer. No one talked about hair typing & there was less talk about good/bad hair & we all used the same products & just shared info on styling. There was a sense of unity. Almost all the TV & magazine ads featured the type 4 afro look with maybe a few looser types.However,the present day ads started out very slanted toward the looser curlies & there was a long stretch where the “light & curly look” was prominent in TV & magazine ads. Light and/or looser haired curlies appeared in Carol’s Daughter & WEN ads, as well as in ads in black magazines.It’s subtle but it’s there even tho there’s been a lot more type 4s in ads. In my experience as a teacher in all black or heavily black schools, some girls & their moms would say they didn’t have the right kind of hair to go natural & I had to read the riot act to elementary school black boys who’d ridicule girls with braid extensions or who wore their hair natural, saying their hair was too nappy for those styles. Hair & skin color discrimination are like viruses that lay dormant for periods of time then rear their ugly heads every so often, then seem to vanish but never really go away.
I would like to experience that whenit comes to hair community in general. Jessie’s Curl is also a good brand for all curl patterns. I really like their stuff. I have to give the maker props.
” In fact the girls who had loose curls were trying to get theirs to kink up to get that Afro Sheen look.”
My mom said she had the same issue (although, she doesn’t have loose curls at all). Everybody wanted Type 4 because, in her words, “My afro would just flop.” She would use sponge rollers and fluff it out to get a decent afro effect.
When I first heard about the hair typing system I thought it took out the racial element of describing hair as growing up a black African girl my hair was described jus as that black, african hair, afro hair, it never took into account that non mixed black africans can hav variations to our curl pattern and strands and hence limitin what I believed my hair with variations. my hair is unique to me not necessarily to my ethnic background.
I think you may have to factor in stretched out length & hair color…
but the length part is part of texture discrimination. their hair might very well be the same length. 10 inches of 4c hair will not look like 10 inches of 2b hair.
as for the color…i’ve met a grand 2 black women with naturally blond hair in my life. so if you’re saying “no, it isn’t texture discrimination it is just one has longer, blond hair and the other has short, black hair” then i’m going to have to point out that only strengthens the racial aspect of the discrimination people claim exists
Many people will view/ like/ follow/ comment etc on the videos/ regimens they identify with most.
Some will do the same thing with the videos/ regimens they’d like to identify with but don’t.
It’s always been like this… WAY before the system came into play.
But this is OUR natural hair and it’s a damn shame that we’ve allowed people (from the media to family/friends) to dictate to us what is ‘good’ hair and what isn’t.
If you’re embarking on this natural journey then stop with the ‘discrimination’/hating/watching and embrace what God gave you; learn to love your coils/ kinks/ curls for what they are.
This is YOUR journey, after all.
This is the backlash you get when you try to make a community out of hair. Enjoy your own hair. Nobody else need apply.
After going through a million and one youtube videos about hair texture/type discrimination and why some girls are tired of sick of the natural hair community I noticed something. Most of the girls complaining were girls with kinky, coily hair. I found a few vids with girls with curly hair complaining but less than 7. The majority of the girls complaining had gorgeous kinky hair. Just putting it out there…. If you’re smart enough you’ll pick up on what I’m hinting at lol.
The hair typing was a bit helpful to me in the beginning of my journey, but once I figured out my hair and what I was doing I rarely identified with the system unless someone asked me. It only covers the diameter/size of curl, That’s it? There are many other important aspects to our natural hair that should be considered when looking for help with styles and products.
As for the division, unfortunately, it seems African Americans always find a way to divide themselves. I have noticed this with many things that are not hair related? And as for texture discrimination it does exists amongst loose naturals and problem always will because of how deeply rooted that its. But check this out. I recently loc’d my hair and started connecting with a lot of people in the loc’d hair community and found there was division there as well, and everyone’s hair pretty much looks kinky aka nappy, once its fully locked! ? But some still find a way to divide by claiming their way of locking, or the size of their locks are better or more organic than the next head of locks. I just shook my head when I saw that. Its just sad the many things we create to divide our race.
I agreed with everything you’re saying…until the very end. It isn’t just Black people who foster divisions and hierarchies. It’s human nature–hierarchies and labeling are intrinsic, unfortunately.
Yes I agree with that totally! And wanted to mention that as well, but figured I had said enough already. : ) But yep you are right.
Oh, my god this topic already, Geez! Sometimes I wish this hair typing thing was never invented. Here’s a tip: Stop looking for validation from the number of clicks, likes on social media platforms or from the media in general. Who made the rule that we need the media and the rest of society to validate our worth? Puleeze! From my experience knowing your porosity is way more helpful than hair typing and it’s a lot harder to find bloggers/vloggers that speak to porosity. I’m looking at this stuff like “Great, you have 4c hair like me and your hair is loving and soaking up this product you’re reviewing but what I want to know is this product going sit and build up on top of my low porosity hair?” Texture discrimination? Really? REALLY??? Don’t we have bigger fish to fry as black people? This stuff is for the birds!
There’s a new natural hair vlogger on youtube. She just signed up and her first video has 30,000 views and it’s only been out for 3 weeks. She JUST signed up and already has a few thousand subscribbers. She looks to be mixed with black and chinese or japanese but I’m definitely NOT sure. Only she knows what all she’s mixed with. She’s gorgeous, light skinned and has type 3 hair, no wonder she got so many views in just a few weeks. I’m not trying to stereotype but if it looks like a duck….. I noticed on her channel that she subscribed to ALL VLOGGERS WITH TYPE 1-3 HAIR. NO TYPE 4’s. But then again, why should she? She doesn’t have type 4 hair. Her name is Shizen Wong Lun Hing. Just putting in my two cents.
By the way, did I mention she only has 1 VIDEO UP.
You have beautiful natural hair….the type DOES NOT MATTER!!
i looked her up just now. you’re right. that’s pretty darn fast and for one video. now it’s well done. i’ll give her that. but apparently sista girl was a model and a dancer so i’m willing to bet that her popularity preceded her youtube views, so when she announced on her instagram, and all that that she had a new video, i think people flocked to it because they were already following her on her other social media platforms. that’s just my guess.
Wow you are so right. It is very bizarre how that works. It’s not really texture discrimination as much as racial discrimination at this point. The more white you look, the better. Notice that her hair is dyed blonde….
I’m tired of hearing type 4 girls complain and a lot of you take your frustration out on type 3 hair. There’s always some article comparing the two types, write articles about companies showing ads with type 2 and 3 hair. Call those companies out by name and maybe things will really start moving instead of debating about hair types all day. Thank goodness for my type 3 hair, I love it up all day, everyday.
as someone with type 3 hair…your post reeks of selfishness. it is so odd to me that blk ppl allow the majority to suffer in the name of appeasing the minority.
when kinky hair/ dark skin/ afro featured ppl complain of their treatment someone like you always comes with your “be quiet complaining. we need to have unity. blah blah. blah” yet when you’re benefiting from racism we hear none of that unity crap. all of a sudden you think you earned that sh*t.
you did absolutely nothing to earn your type 3 hair, and feeling any sort of appreciation for the attention you get is nothing more than thirst on your part.
we’re so quick to call out white ppl for benefiting from centuries of white racism but when it comes to blks who benefit from white racism it’s a totally different story.
Stop stereotyping. Not all dark skinned girls has kinky/afro hair. I know a lot of dark skinned and when I say dark I mean DARK with type 3a hair. You can be orange with type 4 hair or purple with type 2 hair. Skin color doesn’t matter or has crap to do with hair that grows out of everyone’s scalp. I’ve seen a 100% caucasian girl (her parents and grandparents were white) with kinky-coily hair. Her hair looked to be 4a/4b and both of her parents had stick straight hair, she looked exactly like her Dad and had really pale skin so she wasn’t mixed in anyway. I dislike stereotyping.
By the way, @wow. How does one earn type 3 hair? Wth is up with that? Stop putting type 3 hair on a pedestal. ALL hair types are equal and beautiful.
The hair typing system didn’t cause any of this. This started a long time ago, it was called ‘good hair/soft hair/nice hair’ vs ‘rough/coarse/bad hair’. You type 4’s are always complaining about something. The 4a’s don’t complain as much as the 4b’s and 4c’s. I think type 4 girls don’t like the type chart because they are just that, type 4 and there’s a lot of stigma attached to type 4 or kinky/coily hair if you will. Type 3 girls face discrimination too but they don’t complain as much, they keep it moving. I’m not trying to minimize the type 4 struggle, all I’m saying is be a strong woman and keep it moving. Screw the biased ads that hair companies show and keep pushing.
I would have to say that is has gotten better, but we have a long way to go. This natural movement is really 4 b and c chicks ditching the creamy crack. once more of us come out and embrace our own hair and stop wishing we were curly the more this good hair crap will fade away.
I am very disappointed with a lot of these comments. Some of you make it seem like type 3 girls should apologize and feel bad about having type 3 hair. I have a young cousin who is fully black and has type 2 hair! I damn well don’t want anyone to make her feel like she has to apologize for having slightly wavy hair. A lot of us were born with type 3 hair, whether we’re mixed or not. I’m not mixed, both of my parents are black and I have type 3b/3c hair. I’m not light skinned either. I was born with medium-dark skin, curly hair and I love everything about me. I shouldn’t have to feel bad for what God blessed me with. The stereotypes I see with these comments are just…I’m speechless.
“I shouldn’t have to feel bad for what God blessed me with”. Cringe. You totally missed the point.
I didn’t miss the point, I got what the article was saying. My comment was in reference to some of the mean, negative comments that a few people left about type 3 hair, type 3 girls and the comments about stereotype. And yes, I SHOULDN’T HAVE TO FEEL BAD FOR WHAT GOD BLESSED ME WITH. WHATEVER GOD DOES IS WELL DONE! You obviously didn’t realize what my comment was in reference to so have a seat.
I have no idea where the hair typing system came from and frankly, I would like to know. I’m not sure what purpose it serves other than a purely scientific one that hair product companies could use to classify their products. I think that since the natural hair look has taken off over the last few years that we’re in the beginning stages of building a body of knowledge about our hair: how to style it, take care of it, what products are available, etc. I would certainly hope that there is not some kind of ‘division’ within the hair typing community, but I’m not surprised by it.
Many of us have finally come to see and accept the beauty of our own hair texture but consider how long the journey to this acceptance has been. We have been under an insidious psychological assault on our self-esteem ever since our ancestors had the misfortune of being kidnapped and brought to this country by racist whites. They proceeded to do everything they could to tear down, destroy, and inflict physical and psychological damage on our people and that included trying to destroy our image of ourselves as women. It can literally take centuries to recover from something like that and I think that we are still in the process of ‘deprogramming’ ourselves. It takes time to purge ourselves of the toxic idea that straight/curly hair is beautiful (exclusively) and the hair we have is ‘ugly’ so yes, that notion is still accepted by many of our people.
I have worn my hair natural off and on since the 1980’s whether it was popular or not, because I have always gone my own way and followed my own ideas about what I thought was beautiful. If some men didn’t like it, then so be it because I wasn’t wearing my hair natural to please anyone but myself. I never had any negative comments or reactions directed at me from strangers because of my natural hair, however. I absolutely love the gorgeous natural hair that I’m seeing on the sisters nowadays and I’m breathing a sigh of relief that we’ve finally progressed to the level of self-acceptance needed to rock it.
I believe Oprah’s hair stylist came up with the system.
It came from oprah stylist you himself stated that 4 types should relax their hair. I don’t even understand why we follow a system that clearly suggests relaxing as a better option and also putting kinky hair at the bottom.
I really don’t understand why people are trying to do away with hair typing. Hair typing is what helped me to realize that I will NEVER have Tarenguy’s curls on my 4c hair no matter how many different type of gels or brushes or shingling methods I try. Do I need hair typing as much now that I am years into caring for my natural hair? No. I needed it to guide my understanding of what my hair could/could not do and why. I need it now to have realistic expectations of styling outcomes. It was never a matter of good hair vs bad hair. It was a matter of “very bad hair day/week”.
If hair typing makes no difference in your life, well God bless you and BYE. There are those of us who find it resourceful and my purse and follicles thank me for discovering it.
the thing that bothers me about this post is that your hairstyle wasn’t a hairstyle but someone else’s (taren’s) hair texture. that my dear is a problem.
I keep reading to figure out where you came to that conclusion and I’m stumped. The only problem is the one you concocted. I am at peace with all of my kinks.
1. Taren got the particular style that I was of interest in by using the Huetiful hair steamer. So, technically that would be a style since her hair doesn’t do that normally. Hence the reason she raved about the steamer.
2. Before I discovered hair typing, I thought my hair could do whatever I wanted it to. If I didn’t achieve it, then I was using the wrong products or methods.
3. Everyone does not “go natural” to purposely embrace their hair or for some kind of kumbaya, back to the motherland reason. I stopped getting relaxers because I was tired of the wait and cost and, at the time, I was wearing weaves cause I can cut weave into a bob and not cry over it. When my wallet got tired of that, I needed to understand what my hair was doing. That is how I discovered the natural hair community.
This is nothing new in the black community, it’s the same old “good hair vs bad hair” mentality, perhaps the media is to blame, i’m not sure, but i think it’s time for black women to embrace our beauty, own it and stop looking for validation from everyone else.
My sentiments exactly
Hair typing does not hurt the natural hair community. It is a guide to caring for your hair type (and is not exclusive to Black hair styling btw). The mentality of people – be they natural or not – is what “helps” or “hurts” the natural hair community. At the end of the day, how some styles look on various hair types does not make one better or more or less beautiful than the other. Products that work for one hair type will not work for another. It’s just like certain haircuts fit certain face shapes. Does that mean one face shape is better than the other? I think we all know the answer to that question. The key to natural hair is to embrace what works for your hair type and stop trying to force your hair to be something it is not. This was the primary reason I thought many women went natural to begin with – at least it’s why I did. I remember watching myself in the mirror as I flat ironed my relaxed hair – yet again – for a night out. I hated the process. I hated the smell of the iron in my hair. And I thought to myself, “Why do you keep doing this? Stop it right now. If you were meant to have permanently straight hair, you would have been born with it.” And so I stopped.
Speaking of which, there was no “natural hair community” when I went natural 17 years ago, meaning you were not supported by anyone in your natural hair care journey, be you loosely curled or tightly coiled. So even though (according to the comments here) I would now have what is considered a coveted natural hair type, when I went natural NO natural hair type was desirable, and, for the record, I was absolutely subjected to discrimination. I am somewhere in the middle as far as hair types go, and received a bevy of negative comments from other Black people, including family members. Nappy, pickaninny – I’ve heard it all. There were men who rejected me because they did not like natural hair period – no matter what “type” it was. Guys who liked natural hair were few and far between. Most Black women were still relaxing their hair on a far larger scale than they are now – and natural was not accepted. What got me through was the fact that I do not need someone else’s approval to validate my beauty. I do not need anyone else’s approval to feel good about myself. I think it helped that the first school I attended as a child did a very good job of reinforcing “Black is beautiful” – no matter what shade or hair type you may be or have. Learn to recognize brainwashed people and stop allowing them to make you feel bad about yourself. Just stop it. Stop being weak. Stop comparing yourself to others and allowing others to compare you. Learn to appreciate all hair types – regardless of how another person reacts to you out of ignorance. More importantly, don’t project their ignorance onto other women with natural hair. We are born with what we are born with. None of us had a choice in the matter. We are all beautiful. Have some self confidence for godsakes. It goes a long way. I always heard that growing up and never realized how true it was until I matured. I’ve seen bald women with self-confidence fare better than the women with any type of hair and self-esteem lower than the bottom of their boots. If someone does not like or accept you for who you are, you need to learn how to dismiss them and let them know how fabulous you are regardless of what they think. If that means you have to literally tell them, “B**ch I’m fabulous!” then do that. I have given people the speech; the this-is-how-I-choose-to-wear-my-hair-and-if-you-don’t-like-it-bye speech. It is better to learn this lesson sooner than later. Get it together, ladies. Love yourselves. Clearly, if you are allowing ignorant people to make you feel bad about yourself and hate other natural women in the process, you don’t love yourself yet. Get there
Hair typing isn’t harming us and the descrimination has been happening WAAAAAY before the hair typing system even began. I’m 3c 4a ish I guess and I don’t really care if people chose to represent looser curl patterns. When it comes to the media, things that are aesthetically pleasing to the eye will always be represented first. Now, that isn’t to say everyone’s hair isn’t beautiful at all but just because the young lady on the left has more views doesn’t validate anything. Her hair is beautiful and so is the young lady on the right. Comparing only creates a division rather than accepting our differences!
I think you’re missing the fact that our aesthetic preferences are socially-constructed. The same logic you’ve invoked has been used to explain away the absence of people of color generally in the media.
I think texture discrimination happens a lot with ads and which natural haired models are chosen to represent the face of a company because they use a lot of looser curled women. But I think its BS to use things like YouTube views counts, likes, and shares as evidence of discrimination. Because you need to take EVERYTHING into account when validating viewership, not just hair. People are automatically drawn to length, unique styles, unique advice, vibrant personalities, and no lie I noticed a lot of naturals who discussed other things other than just hair (like makeup), or wore very cute clothing had a lot of views on their videos and in the comments I see a lot of “oh where’d you get that lipstick” “I love your necklace” etc.
I just feel like there’s so many factors when it comes to WHY someone has more views than the next person.
I agree! There’s a YT vlogger that has almost “classic length” (longer than tailbone length) natural hair – ballerina1. Her hair type looks to be a 3c. Her views average in the hundreds and low thousands. I like her videos and her simple regimens. Her hair is striking, but the quality of her videos are not great, they are grainy and not well lit. She doesn’t really wear any make-up. If she does; it’s very little. Also she seems to be shy; she’s soft spoken – kind of like a “hippie.” Conversely, there’s another YT vlogger, Char Jay, I think her name is. Her make-up looks like a professional did it. She’s always very gussied up and does a variety of different creative styles. She also uses a lot of pricey products. Her hair is 4b and stops at her shoulders. Of course, there are some people who are always going to make over vloggers with loosely curled or loosely waved hair. But thankfully, it’s more about presentation, personality, editing software, content of channel and above all one’s own personal preference than it is about having a certain hair type. For instance, I’m not into make-up and my taste in clothes is different so I like ballerina1’s channel a bit better than Char Jay’s.
Hi I have been natural for 6 months now and I would like to know what hair type I am. Thank you and blessings.:-)
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I’d say 4b with a little 4a in there.
You have beautiful natural hair….the type DOES NOT MATTER!!
POROSITY IS MORE IMPORTANT.
Just saying it really is more important that a hair type.
We give 3s too much praise and label it “good hair”
We need to love our 4s
I think that it’s people, not hair typing that has caused texture discrimination in the natural hair community. I have always heard the terms good hair, nice hair, soft hair, mixed when people refer to type 3 hair and negative remarks related to type 4b or c hair; waaaay before hair typing came about. The hair typing system helped me with a reference point when I was learning how to take care of and style my natural hair. Without the actual numbers/letters I would still have looked for people with similar hair to mine but it would have been more of a blind search. It’s not a necessity persay but we’d be using it anyways just not the official science. I think people need to learn to love what they have and stop comparing themselves to others or thinking that one feature is better than another. This is an issue with weight, eye colour, skin colour, hair colour….I could go on and on….
The preference for a particular hair texture and curl pattern started way, way, way before typing of hair. The typing of hair just gives you a label to associate with the hair type and helps market products at a extremely marked up price.
This is exactly what I was going to say. It was nothing to do with the creation of the system, the preferences and biases go beyond that. Having the hair typing system definitely helped me when I first went natural in terms of regimen and products and different styles to try…heck I still find it useful! It’s just a tool, people who are going to discriminate are going to do so regardless of whether the different textures have names.
I have only been natural for a yr and i have no clue what hair type i have and honestly it never mattered. I look to youtube for styles because that was my biggest challenge. Having a perm all my life, i was at a loss for what to do with my hair. But through process of elimignation i have found what works for now wbith my hair. My friend who is also natural with a coarser texture was surprised that my hair curls when wet, i can do roller wraps wirh no heat and gel can make my edges lay and i am not mixed. I didnt understand the envy because my hair easily breaks, its thin, and gets tangled easy. I say all that to say everyone should embrace what they have because every hair texture has their issues. I dont understand the segregation in hair at all. And thats including permed hair. I know several people who have gorgeous, thick, healthy permed hair. Thos is just one more way that we are allowing society to keep us separate.
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I think it is what it is. My sister who is fully Swedish. While I’m Swedish and bLack. Was told she couldn’t be a natural because she is white. That comment to me was more ignorant then the word ” nigga” . No matter what you are. If your hair is natural, untouched, etc, your a natural. My hair is very much on the less course side . And people also tell me I can’t be natural. Why? Because I’m not a 4c. Or however that system works. She be scared to wear certain styles just like a black girl would.
[img]https://bglh-marketplace.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/image-10.jpg[/img]
Check out my hair care blog in the link I posted. Thanks ya
^^^ Wow. No shade intended, but you really didn’t add to this discussion, though…
if you’re having issues understanding why people would tell your white sister that she can’t be “natural” then i think you fail to understand the very strong race politics that dictate and govern certain aspects of life in the united states and the Caribbean. The reason your sister can’t be “natural” is because that terminology, how it is used by us here on this blog, specifically relates to a natural hair identity within a set context of white supremacy and its detrimental effect on the collective esteem of none other than the descendants of enslaved black americans. “natural hair” was coined and made into a movement by those who needed it most, because it fit the situation at hand in which the vast majority of black girls growing up in this country are pressured, even to this day- although it is changing- to relax their hair and that same number, if not more, are instilled with notions of good hair/bad hair- hence the relaxing. These notions are the direct result of the institution of slavery within our country and a hierarchy put in place for the sole purpose of elevating blacks of mixed racial heritage over those of lesser or non mixed racial heritage. White hair was beautiful and good, black hair was ugly and bad. If you had grown up in the US you would be familiar with the slave jokes that give life to such notions. “You need a relaxer. You startin’ to look like a slave”. “Or i look like a field hand, look at these naps”. The natural hair movement came about as a result of mainly US black womens’ political (originally) stance to counteract the oppression from which we still suffer as a community, and to reclaim our pride in our hair and acknowledge these very kinks and koils that link/ed us with slavery and shame. So, while a white girl can be “natural” in the sense that she’s never had a relaxer, the reality is that there is no pressure hanging over white girls’ heads, in our country or any other (as i’m aware), compelling them to submit to painful, harmful chemicals on roughly a bimonthly basis to get them to reject one of the most prominent outward manifestations of their racial/cultural identity. Which means that natural for a white girl is not going to have the same meaning as natural for a black girl, and it will be understood in an entirely different context if she appropriates the terminology. Sweden never experienced the cultural divide and sub-cultural divide i’ve mentioned. I’m sure it has its instances of racism, but all in all, it is a pretty mono-racial society, culture, country, so a white girl from Sweden, up to even a biracial girl from Sweden, i feel, has no right to claim ties to a movement neither seem to know anything about or be able to relate to. Put another way, if we’d been waiting on Sweden or any Scandinavian country to bring about the natural hair movement, we’d still be waiting on it, because it just wasn’t necessary in your country because for the most part, Swedish society never went out of its way to denigrate and demean Africanness or African phenotypes (for the most part, and if so, then certainly not NEARLY on the scale of white society in the USA. if you’re unaware, then *please* look it up before replying. it’s pretty big.) So yes, if your white sister calls her hair natural in reference to the natural hair movement, using it as a black woman in the US would use “natural”, i think she is displaying an acute lack of cultural awareness and sensitivity. And that’s putting it nicely. to be blunt, she’s being ignorant. and you are too, for cosigning on the foolishness. there’s other ways for white girls to describe their lack of chemical-ness, and personally i can honestly say i’ve never ever heard a white girl use the word “natural” to describe her hair unless she was specifically referring to hair color. Again, totally different contexts.
As for you yourself being natural, given the parameters, the designation would still extend to you given that you’re readably “black” and with a hair type that black people consider to fall within the range of the natural hair sphere. I do agree that it would be dumb for a black person to go so far as to tell you you’re not natural on account of your hair texture being loose, especially since it doesn’t take being biracial to have a loose texture of hair. but that’s ignorance on the part of that individual.
OMG…that doesn’t come close to being worse than the n word. Stop sounding ignorant.
Well there is definitely texture discrimination in the black hair community. However, these two examples have too many different factors involved. Who are they? How many times was the photo/YouTube page shared? How many subscribers? The hair color is different. The lighting is different. The style is slightly different. It looks like two different hair lengths. An experiment needs to be conducted using the same products, hair color, hair length, by the same stylist, photographer, make up, etc., and maybe with one each, a 3b, 4a, & 4c hair types.
i agree. i think lurking variables remain to be considered. the picture on the left is more much visually clear as well as eye-catching, in large part because of the girl’s highlights (yay! Her highlights are werking for her, doing what they’re supposed to do lol). the picture on the right is not nearly as visually defined and therefore naturally draws the eye less. but i think that the popularity of the photos might have more to do with the popularity of the vloggers themselves, as you said. i recognize Alyssa but i don’t recognize the girl on the right. And on another note, Alyssa draws a less niche viewership and audience than i imagine a girl who appears to be full black would when it comes to hair, because Alyssa’s audience, i’ve noticed, seems to be made up of people of a variety of races or ethnic groups. Her viewership isn’t largely confined to just black women but extended to other mixed women, women of other cultures where the hair is loosely curled (arab, and so on), white girls, etc. The girl on the right, if all she vlogs about is hair, is going to have viewership largely restricted to black women, because people tend to watch and follow those with hair types like their own. And in a world context, i believe that type 4 hair is largely limited to just those of South/West/East African descent (possibly some North Africa to, by percentage). Which means most of the world won’t be able to identify. So in short, i do think that this “data” is inconclusive.
The hair type system is obviously not flawless…but for now this is the only thing we’ve got…I could criticise but as I am not able to suggest something better I think I’m gonna shut my mouth. We have to understand that we are still at the beginning of the nappy movement so of course we still have to make some ajustements…as everything new we are searching…so the hair type system can be improved but for now this is not so bad…at least with it we got to understand that there was not only one type of hair but various with specifities in care, hairstyles etc
Does it hurt the community ? a bit…because I truly believe the human being cannot just say “things are different” and stop there. The human being says “things are different and this one is better than this one, and this other is worse than this one”…we cannot only différentiante we have to set a hierarchy…in a idéal world, having (and not being because we are not our hair) a 2b hair should be as great as having a 4A or 4C etc…well welcome into the real world…Society has decided that the straight hair would be the “good hair”, curly “ok hair” and kinky “wtf hair”…inside the natural community we implemented the same discrimination…curly “good hair”…kinky= why me ?…
I don’t blame it on the vloggers, bloggers with loosers textures…they were born that way, should they apologise for it ? should they feel ashamed for not “being black enough” ? Are we gonna do some kind of “reverse discrimination where some women will be too light-skinned or too curly to belong to the community ? Is that the kind of movement we want to build ? The first to blame are the followers who watch these videos thinking the looser texture is better…
I have 4C hair…do I like my hair ? hell yeah! am I proud of my 4C hair? no…it is just my hair…not something I achieved.
Let’s be honest we still have some identity and selfesteem issues to solve in the community…no need to go in history of slavery, ségrégation, apartheid…we all know that.
So of course, curly girls have a more “desired hair”…we won’t solde that over the night…but I am optimistic about the fact that this mentality is disappearing little by little (I may be naïve). I truly hope in 20 years being nappy or natural won’t be a thing anymore but just the normal thing to do…than 3b,4B will be treated equally see themselves and each other are simply nappy and not better nappy or I don’t know what…
I think we need to go back to the basics of what it meant to go natural. I think the natural movement in the 70s is it what this current movement should aspire to be . It wasn’t about trying to make your natural hair look more European with curls and ringlets. but embracing the undefined hair and rocking it. How do we get to that point?
kemimag.blogspot.com
This is a good point. In the 70s, it seems as though Black people were outwardly (literally!) showing their blackness. On the other hand, many people were still manipulating their hair then by picking it out and pulling the curls out.
I think hair will always be an accessory; a way to express your personality and current trends. True freedom will be when black people feel free to style their hair without societal pressure and without persecution through their job, family, friends and bystanders.
I too would like to see a deemphasis on curl and more focus on just healthy hair and low manipulation styles. As far as terms, personally, I’ve always been partial to the word puff 😛
Hi, i’m french and i can say that in france a large number of natural black girl have 4a-4b-4c hair. Some have 3abc but most of them are mixed. I envy a lot of girl with curly not kinky hair because when I watch some hairstyle tutorial I don’t achieve their look. It seems that i can’t do anything with my hair, even ponytail, it’s always afropuff ( every single day). I won’t come back to rleader but I’m really frustrated. Don’t know what to do.
I truly hope I do not come across sounding rude, but how about watching videos specifically catered to your hair type or visiting blogs designed to uplift women with kinkier hair?
As someone with kinky hair myself who big chopped my senior year of high school where the popular girls who were coveted were the curly heads, I was in the same boat as you. But it became extremely unhealthy for me to be envying women with hair unlike mine, so one day as I was watching a Youtube video with someone who had 3c hair, I suddenly asked myself “What are you doing?” And then I suddenly stopped watching the video, removing myself from the source of frustration and quitting cold turkey. I then began to take actual steps to love and learn my own head of hair. And I did. Because honestly, if you cannot learn to love your hair first, this idea of “hair envy” will always continue. You will always find yourself frustrated.
That alone truly makes a huge difference, and you will then begin to see and explore all of the versatile and amazing things you can do with your hair outside of afro-puffs.
I don’t totally agree with you. Up to me, a woman with 4B/4C hair should have the right to watch a woman with 3A and vice versa…I mean I am sure we all (or at least in the majority) can give good hair care or hairstyles advice. As it is easier to find curly nappy…the 1st time I did a frohawk, I got the inspiration from a curly vlogger.. (I have 4C hair) and I was so happy! My hair did what a 4C hair does and OMG I was so happy…I never expected it to curl or anything. I know my hair…I don’t think kinky should only follow kinky and curly should follow kinky…we are a community and we should support each other and progress all together. Besides I believe thick vs thin hair is even more important than the hair type…I have thin hair and I feel almost no connection to 4C thick type because it is a very strong hair..my hair can breaks just by being watched and I know a girl with another hair type but with thin hair will probably understand me better than a 4C..she will expérience a lot of breakage, problems to style the hair because of low density etc etc.
In short, we should not turn this into a battle field…otherwise there is no point to this movement.
[img]https://bglh-marketplace.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Frohawk.jpeg[/img]
Bonjour Pinkychocolate!
Je suis française aussi, je te conseille la chaîne de Beautiful Naturelle! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJS7wxfaY6U Elle est française, ses cheveux sont de type 4 et elle a plein d’idées coiffure!
N’envie pas les filles aux cheveux 3abc, les cheveux 4 sont très beaux et je suis sûre que tu as de très beaux cheveux aussi!
Je te conseille, après chaque shampoing, d’étirer tes cheveux (tu fais des tresses ou des vanilles sur cheveux mouillés, tu laisses sécher naturellement et le lendemain, tu défais les tresses ou vanilles et tu passes un coup de peigne). Puis, fais tes coiffures sur cheveux étirés. Moi, après chaque shamppoing, j’étire mes cheveux selon la méthode de Girlsloveyour curls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3WvYqdCRgs
Cette méthode permet un coiffage + facile, et évite la formation de noeauds. Puis toute l’année, je fais des braid-out, twist-out ou mini-twists (et aux grandes occasions des chignons) sur cheveux étirés de cette manière. Et puis sur les braid-out, les twist-out et les mini-twists, tu peux faire plein de coiffure! 🙂
Bon courage à toi, que Dieu te bénisse! 🙂
Je suis d’accord avec Taiwo, c’est important qu’au lieu de suivre seulement les YouTubers avec les cheveux type 3, il faut chercher ceux qui font des videos pour ton type, sinon (comme moi avant) tu vas seulement detester tes cheveux parce que tu n’arrive pas à faire les coiffures comme les femmes avec les cheveux moins crépus. Il y a beaucoup de choses qu’on peut faire avec les cheveux type 4 (à part les puffs), meme de choses que les autres types ne peuvent pas faire avec leurs cheveux!
I agree with Taiwo, it’s important that instead of only following YouTubers with Type 3 hair, you must look for those who make videos for your own hair type, otherwise (like me before), you’ll only start to hate your own hair because of not being able to achieve the same results with styles like women with less kinkier hair. There are lots of things you can do with Type 4 hair (apart from puffs), even things that other types might not be able to do with THEIR hair!
And I can’t imagine why people are giving you thumbs down, it’s an understandable frustration that I have had (and sometimes continue to have) because of my kinky 4a-c African hair, you just have to keep going and find the right hair bloggers for you. Admiration is good, envy leads to insecurity!
I dont think its texture discrimination, many latinas and multiple other races have thick curly hair 3a,3c, etc so they have more thumbs up because of more viewers but the 4a,b,c type has less thumbs up because they are resticted mostly black people
This is a ridiculous conversation. As far as I see it, one fool makes many and I have joined the lot in even bothering to leave a comment. First off, i believe looking at the negative always amplifies it. These ‘Discriminators’ would not have so much of an impact if we ignored and pretended as if discrimination is silly. To sit down, analyze them (discriminators) and then wonder if you are the same, is way too confusing. Girl! As long as you big chopped, transitioned etc, and are struggling through (if you look at it that way) that back breaking journey of going waist length, it says something. It says you love who you are. Watch what you want to watch. like what you want to like. In the end, its loving you and not wondering if everybody loves and then feeling unhappy because you may feel discriminated against. It is a silly cycle of folly…………
The biggest thing wrong with the Natural community I am noticing is, EVERYONE WANTS TO BE FAMOUS. Who cares how many shares you got? Who cares how many views someone had? There is literally no “natural hair tutorial” that brings new stuff two the table. Lets face it, regardless of texture, a 2-Strand twist out is the same twist out WE’VE ALL SEEN BEFORE. Unless you’re a new start up/self made company, people on YouTube and Facebook need to go ahead and have a stadium full of seats. Stop trying to become the next “Curly Nikki” and just be happy with a great head of hair. There are a myriad of natural hair resources out there, quit trying to reinvent the wheel and become the next “HAIR GURU”.
Yes! You raise a very, very good point that it is definitely not about becoming the next “Curly Nikki” or “natural hair guru”, which is becoming a trend these days unfortunately. I notice that too. However, not everyone is wanting to be famous, or cares about the numbers they get through “shares” or “likes”. That is a pretty steep generalisation, because I can definitely speak for myself. When I started my own natural hair blog to document my journey last year and my Youtube channel this year, I was incredibly discouraged in both instances because all that I kept thinking about was “What is the point?” or “What can I even offer?” Yet, I pushed myself to do those things because I didn’t want to defeat myself, and because I had the support of others who pushed me as well.
In that same respect, there are many women who are actually coming to Youtube or starting blogs because they are realising their texture/type is not AS well-represented on these platforms, or simply because they personally feel they have something to offer. Truth of the matter is, it actually takes real courage to step outside of your comfort zone and put yourself out there, especially if you are not the type of person to do that, and also when there so many resources with tutorials, regimens, etc out there already. And to an extent I do agree with you in a sense that “it has all been done”, but it’s also important to understand that knowledge should always come in abundance. It should continue to be shared, and the same goes for inspiration. And although it is very true that some YT vloggers or bloggers are doing it for all the wrong reasons, there are those who actually want to do it for the right ones.
I love all hair types! We have something to learn from each other’s different textures. I think appreciating each other’s difference will draw us closer. That is what SHOULD matter.
I’ve been natural a little over an year now but do dye my hair like ever 3 months. Can someone please tell me what is my hair type
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4c
I think it’s hard to tell unless you examine the hair while wet and product free. You may also need to look at individual strands to more closely see in what shape the hair bends.
She is asking for some help. Why do you thumbs down her ? This following link should help you to détermine what is your hair type: http://www.naturalhairrules.com/hair-type/
There are many articles on the topic, of course on BGLH but you just have to type : natural hair types andre walker in a search engine and you will find plenty resources.
It is not easy to détermine your hair type only with a partial picture especially if you dye your hair. You’d better do it yourself. I hope I helped.
A little over a year and that’s the longest your hair is???? Obviously you aren’t retaining length. I’ve been natural for exactly 1 year and have 12 inches of hair. Lay off the hair coloring and deep condition more hun, take a multivitamin and maybe a hair, skin and nails vitamin.
Really? Maybe retaining length isn’t a main goal of hers…where do you come off with this? And you’re lying about either the length of time you’ve been natural or the length of your hair. Even deviating from averages, the most you could likely retain in a year is 10 inches. Some of that length you have is from transitioning, boo.
Maybe she prefers a short style..not every natural aspires to tail bine length hair….
You do realize hair grows at different speeds for everyone right? And that some people are obsessive trimmers of their ends. There was definitely a better way you could have worded all that. No need to make her feel low.
You’re kinda mean
@Lisa Coston – from the picture it’s really hard to tell. It looks like 4b/c….I’ve noticed that some hair dyes alter your curl pattern. My colored ends are looser than my roots mainly because my hair is older on the ends but I can see a slight difference between my colored hair and my 3 inches of growth. Like others said.. google hair typing or use this site.. you’ll see what category you may lie around.. no one is exactly what the chart is.. it’s just good to know how close you are to know how to care for your hair. 🙂
I personally think that this conversation is more than a little pointless. As a 4b/4c natural myself, i do notice that most natural hairstyles aim at replicating a particular aesthetic specifically that of curly and/or straight hair and concealing any hint of kinky hair texture.
I personally quit attempting to achieve any sort of curl, coil or pin straight style because my hair does not comply. As a huge youtube fan, i do appreciate all hair types but i often wonder…Why like the dupe of anything when the original will always look so much better?
I am convinced that when type 4 bloggers and vloggers embrace a more genuine appreciation for their own hair, the INTERNET natural hair community will definately be more forthcomming.
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This is so sad. What was meant to be a movement and journey to unite, encourage, and support black women has eventually turned into divisions, envy, and arguments. Disappointing and unfortunately not surprising. Why can’t for once prove to ourselves, our children, and other races that we all get along and love on one another? Smh.
We’re still growing, still at the starting line. Some people have a pessimistic, critical ‘give up’ attitude, but IMO all is not lost at the first sign of trouble. What’s ‘disappointing and unfortunately not surprising’ is the instant gratification, win-or-lose attitude applied to Black women. We seldom get multiple chances to grow and succeed like others, huh? We’re human. We’re going to have struggles, disagreements, arguments, Rome wasn’t built in a day.
And FYI: we’ve always been proud monuments of self-love, we wouldn’t be here today if that weren’t true. And when you know something, no need to “prove” it to strangers who don’t love you anyway.
This is sooooooooooo true. But my thing is I’m so tired of type 4 girls making light of type 3 girls hair struggle. What I’m also tired of is hearing how they’re embracing their kinky-coily, coily-coarse hair but then they’re doing twist outs and bantu knots trying to replicate type 3 hair. Type 4 hair is gorgeous, it’s kinky, coily, sometimes coarse but it’s always beautiful. I love seeing gorgeous, fully coarse, kinky and coily hair. Why say you’re embracing your hair and teaching young girls to embrace their hair when you’re doing styles to replicate a texture that you don’t have and a lot of young girls don’t have as well. They’re going to want type 3 hair and eventually watch mostly type 3 hair videos. I’m not trying to throw shade, just voicing my opinion.
Go ahead and voice your opinion, but please keep in mind that a good portion, dare I say a majority, of kinky-haired ladies are not just doing twist-outs to replicate curls.
I’m “type 4” (seriously y’all, most of us are multitextured -___-), and I do twist-outs to avoid knots and tangling. That’s it. My twist-outs are big and undefined, and I prefer them that way. No curl envy here.
I was actually seriously considering cutting my relaxer off into a brush cut and going natural this weekend. Thank you all so much for sharing your various experiences and points of view. I will be stopping by the beauty supply store on my way home for my relaxer. This is way too overrated and discouraging. I have a very busy life outside my hair regimen and I refuse to put that amount of energy into my hair. As long as mine is healthy enough for my liking, I’m good. good luck to you all
You are going to let comments from strangers determine whether or not you relax your hair or begin your natural hair journey? You must be WEAK!! #byefelicia
Grow up, own your own choices!
I don’t know whether to pity you for calculating that a 4-part process involving vinyl gloves, neutralizer and caustic chemicals on your scalp is less energy than confronting the hair growing from your head, or for playing the blame game and lying to yourself that YOUR CHOICE to continue perming is anything but you not wanting to return to your natural texture.
I’m not sure who’ve you rehearsed this false rationale for, yourself or for some naturals in your life you’ve decided need an explanation, but no one’s buying “I was going to go natural but complete strangers online stopped me’ defensive posturing. How does a still-growing natural community earn your disdain but Korean BSS owners who check to see if you’ve stolen anything no matter how long you’ve been shopping there, easily earn your cash/trust? You know what’s overrated? Relaxers! You know what’s discouraging? Feeble excuses! Good luck with your busy life of perpetual touch-ups.
I’m so TIRED of hearing about discrimination being against ONLY type 4 hair. People discriminate against type 3’s and other hair types as well and more than you know. Here’s an example. Jouelzy’s video has close to 70,000 views right now and has only been out a month while lovelytootychels video has been out for almost half a year and she only has 15,600 views. I’m going to go out on a limb and say that it’s because of hair type that Jouelzy has so much more views. I guess because Chel’s has type 3 hair people see the title of the video and feel like her being discriminated against because of her having type 3 hair is balarky and not to be taken as serious so they decide not to watch. There’s discrimination against ALL hair types. Typing shouldn’t even matter unless you’re deciding on products (light or heavy products) or trying to figure out a regimen. Whether you agree with me or not the proof is in the photo.
[img]https://bglh-marketplace.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Fullscreencapture67201472543PM.jpg[/img]
YES! Agree 100%
Texture discrimination does exist across hair types but that photo is not proof of anything. One clearly has more subscribers(90,000+) and that specific video of Joelzy’s has been shared and embedded on multiple websites which contributes to the views.
I think that was the point. Jouelzy’s video spread like wild fire because she’s a 4c talking about texture discrimination. Chel’s video didn’t because she was a 3b talking about texture discrimination. If Chel’s had type 4b/4c her video wouldn’t hit every blog too.
I’m sorry but I don’t see it. Please explain to me what type of discrimination type 3 and looser textured hair ladies face in the natural hair community that is soley based on their hair texture? Serious question.
The most important discrimination is the “not black enough” argument that 3s often face. How dare anyone determine that how black someone else is. As a 4, I am particularly saddened to see the backlash against 3s whose hair is simply their hair. Our community has long been obsessed with hair length and texture. Why are we casting “blame” on anyone? Why do we not value the texture we have? Why do we covet the texture of others? Why can we not simply accept that which we have? And why are we upset with others who have a looser texture than us? Why do we not see beauty in ALL types? As the mother of a 3, I wonder why my daughter has to endure the “are you mixed” question so often. I don’t get it. Don’t we not know yet that not only do black people come in all shades but so does our hair come in a multiplicity of textures, curl patterns, curls shapes. Why are we dividing ourselves? The artificial divisions we create are so harmful to the community; I wish we get this right before we tear each other apart.
Type 3’s do experience texture discrimination. There are a lot of people who feel type 3 hair is too kinky. Have you ever been to the DR? There are a lot of type 3 girls who experience discrimination all over the world because of their type 3 hair. I know a 3b who was asked to relax, flat iron her hair or wear a wig by a english lady who had interview her. She told my friend she got the job but she needed to do something about her hair because they wanted strictly straight hair in their work enviorment. My friend had her 3b hair laid and slicked in a very neat bun. When I say neat I mean neat. Then there’s discrimination in the natural hair community that they aren’t black enough or they texturized their hair and that’s why it’s so wavy or loosely curled. I’ve seen type 3 girls be told that they had something done with their hair because they’re too dark to have strictly type 3 hair on a lot of forums. Don’t get me started. EVERYONE has their own hair struggles, don’t try to downplay the type 3 struggle because because you wouldn’t want anyone to downplay your type 4 struggle or whatever kind of hair you have. It doesn’t have to just be about typing it can be wavy, curly, kinky, curly-kinky, kinky-coily, coily etc… Do unto others are you want done unto you. Don’t try to minimize what someone else is going through because you obviously don’t know what their going through.
Well there are a lot of 4b cs in the world so Jouelzy appeals to them. Jouelzy has been around for a while now. Her hair styling videos are really great, to the point and nicely filmed. It’s quite right that 4c women do not watch the other woman because her hair type is so far away from ours and that is not what our hair will do when the same techniques are applied. 3 types have an abundance of YT people out there for them so they become much more choosy based on editing styles, personalities and how close that person’s hair is to theirs. For us 4cs as soon as we see a 4c with the same or near vid quality as the abundant 4as and 3 types on YT, we will watch her but then her hair may not be anything like ours. There are so few 4cs on YT with good, clear videos that when you see one you firstly jump on it then see that their hair is not quite like yours but you watch anyway because it’s near enough. I really think 3s and 4as manage to find hair twins in people like Nap85 etc. if there were more vocal, present and regular posting 4cs, we would begin to target hair twins or become more choosy based on the factors that make other hair types pick one girl over another.
Because of texture differences these are totally different hairstyles. If your hair is 3c then many of your style results will appeal to hair types 2a-3c. The first twist-out looks like something that could be achieved with a curling wand/iron. I can see that appealing to all sorts of people, not just “naturals.” If you have type 4 hair (as I do) then you are probably looking for people with similar hair. If you choose to film a style that has more mainstream results you will probably get more views. However, if you choose a strictly Type 4 style (please do as I would like to watch) then you will probably get views from other Type 4s–a smaller population. Most people on Instagram/YouTube/Etc./ don’t click videos for methods unless they can relate to the results. If you took these two videos and placed them in a country where 4a-c hair is predominant, you’d probably see different view results. The world doesn’t begin and end with YouTube.
This isn’t to say you’re imagining negativity as a type 4, it’s just to say that it becomes a thing of the past when you decide it is.
WHY blame this on “black” people? What about “biracial” and “Latina” women?
Also, I am in a room full of Black people and most of them are not 4C. Step away from the idea that 4C represent “most” blacks.
This article needs to be more than 3 paragraphs. It’s like she lit a fire and walked away. No reasoning or analysis in this article.
that was the point. I dont want to write articles that tell people what to think. I want a conversation to start. I want people to talk about it, talk through it and get whatever they can get out of it.
I’ve come to peace with the fact that, like someone said above, the natural movement has become is “black but not black enough.” I can’t help but feel, however, that girls with looser textures have “usurped,” if you will, the movement from those of us with kinkier textures. It seems as if we’ve paved the way, but now they get the credit for it.
What hair gurus were there that lost their fame because of people with “looser texture”? What websites were dedicated solely to 4C hair?
Hi, I don’t mean that any one has lost their fame, but let’s keep it one hundred percent all the way real and raw, looser textures have ALWAYS been able to shine. There was never any “struggle” for acceptance in the public (this is not to say that they havent had personal struggles with their hair, because we ALL have) for people with looser hair. But now that people with kinkier textures have paved the way, have reclaimed their beauty, have REJECTED societal norms, the only people who are getting shine are looser textures. But as I said, it is what is, I’ve personally accepted it. I don’t care about what the mainstream wants to validate because I am not mainstream, but i think it’s a valid and honest observation.
@Nicole
I completely agree. However I’m going to have to call black women out on what we cosign …yes that’s right we don’t get off scot-free. This whole hair texture discrimination is also facilitated by the fact that so many black women still gravitate to and covet hair that is deemed “not too black/kinky”. There’s still this subconscious need to want to be somewhat validated by mainstream white society. Lets just be honest here. The result is many black women try to live vicariously through women with the more “acceptable” curl while simultaneously handing them a pedestal. Now Im not saying that all black women need to have 4 type hair to be represent black naturals. However I find it troubling when the poster child for natural hair envy are women like Trace Ellis Ross and Taren Guy. Im not suggesting that these women don’t have beautiful hair, because they do. However I am suggesting that they should not be the standard image of a movement that was geared towards black women embracing our hair in its kinkiest form (devoid of any outside validation).
Any minute now our movement with be completely hijacked as we will soon see white women with curly hair hash tagging TEAM NATURAL. Self-hate is still real like a mutha…
[img]https://bglh-marketplace.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/why.jpg[/img]
I have seen this and experience this in my life. If I had a dime for everytime someone has told me you have a nice grade of hair or your hair is soft, or I could never where my hair like yours it is truly sad beauty is more than hair or skin or body type. I dislike hair typing it segregats us. However we continue to do it travel outside the USA and you see all colors all hair types I could care less about a grade I want to learn your nature
[img]https://bglh-marketplace.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/PicsArt_1375582239603.jpg[/img]
To Krys,
I apologize for the thumbs down. I was trying to hit the thumbs up and that happened. I guess trying to do things on your cell isn’t always the greatest. You are a beautiful!
We were separated long before the typing system came into play. It was called ‘good hair’ vs ‘coarse/rough/bad hair’. I don’t subscribe to the whole ‘good hair’ thing, I’m just making a point. This separation and grouping needs to stop though.
As stated by others it’s hard to tell exactly what is going on but what I can say is that it is deeper than just hair. You notice that these two ladies are also different complexions. That certainly can play into people’s preferences as colorism is a huge issue not only in the Black community but around the world (I highly recommend watching Dark Girls which did a good job addressing many issues with colorism). If this were just about hair you would really have to take two photos of just the hair (no face), same color, same composition and lighting and on the same account to get a more accurate measure of preferences towards different texture.
I’ll have to say I’m personally not surprised when Black people show a preference to curl versus kink. Smooth curls are closer to white hair and people still have issues embracing their kinky hair because frankly we just don’t have enough positive role models for it.
I wouldn’t say the divisions are linked to the hair typing system. The hair typing system is used in service of divisions that have long existed. I think people are far too pessimistic on this. At 34 years old when I think of the difference in attitude towards natural hair of any type when I was growing up and now it blows my mind. It would be naive to think that the messages we grew up with would completely disappear in a few years. Of course there are remnants and of course the Right Curl would replace Straight as the standard. But 4b/cs are still going natural, showing off their tresses on youtube/instagram/facebook, going to the conventions and generally serving as active, vocal members of the community. For that reason, I have no doubt that our progress will continue, that we’ll get over the Right Curl the same way we got over Straight. I’ve just seen too many good women doing too much good work to think otherwise.
As someone with 4C hair, hair typing has definitely worked for me.
Also, it hasn’t in a way. For example, I tried using a moisturizing method that a woman with fine 4C hair used. It didn’t work because I have very thick & coarse hair.
Mmmm I watched the 3 strand twist video on the left (Alyssa with the lighter hair). To be fair, she did this on hair that had to have been blow dried or severely heat damaged because her hair was like kinkier with loose curled ends. And her video quality is stellar. I also watched some of the 4b/c girls do it and the quality of the video generally wasn’t as good. You couldn’t even see some of them were doing.
I think a better example wouldve been Taren, who’s videos are very popular although her hair is so unique to her that I doubt many of those people watching could even use her hair tips. Or NaturalNeicey who again has such unique hair with her particular mix of ethnicities that those styles would only work on few people. There is definitely a bias when it comes to looser textured naturals though.
I can’t say I benefit from the hair typing system; it’s usually the last resort when considering a product or style. I just pay attention to what my hair likes and what I notice is beneficial.
It’s hard to say on the outside why someone would share one image over the other. I’d be naive not to acknowledge that unfortunately there still are some people who prefer or obsess over a looser curl pattern then one that’s more kinky. That way of thinking has been going on for a very long time; there’s a larger issue that won’t be resolved in a comment section. Then again, for all we know, people shared one image more because they knew the person in the photo, maybe wanted a similar hair color, etc. We simply don’t know. The only thing we personally have control over is how we react to a photo and why we’re sharing it. I like to see photos of all different hair types, not simply those that may mirror my own.
The natural hair movement was supposed to enhance and celebrate Black girs’beauty. It was supposed to restore our younger sister’s self-esteem by telling them how beautiful they are, by telling them there’s nothing to be sorry about. After being told for years and years that we didn’t deseerve to be called beautiful, we finally discovered the beauty of one of the most important feminine attributes, our hair.
Yet, the natural hair movement was about much more than hair. That was about celebrating our Blackness. A Blackness without compromise.
I thought the day finally came when Black girls stopped being alienated by the beauty standards promoted by the (white) mainstream media. I thought we finally found out that we did not need to have pale skin, long flowing hair and straight nose to be beautiful.
I was way too naive.
The natural community does celebrate our Blackness but still a Blackness with compromise. Just the way Black magazines promote Black beauty by only putting light-skinned girls on covers, the natural hair community celebrates Black hair by putting curls on a pedestal.
The message is clear. It is ok to be Black…but not too Black.
Just don’t look like you come from the depths of Africa.
Therein lies the paradox: Celebrating Black beauty while only promoting altered versions of it.
Your comment is 100% true and it hurts my heart. Almost makes me want to cry. I don’t care about changing the black community or the rest of the world, how do we really start to change the way we as black women, girls and teens think about our hair without waiting on everyone else to validate us? Is it even possible? Once again, my heart hurts.
I agree about believing that the natural hair movement is about embracing who you are and loving yourself as God made you.
I think the hair typing system is helpful as a starting point for new naturals to get an idea about their hair texture and determine the products that would generally be beneficial to their hair. I used it similarly to how the author of this article used it.
I believe there are divisions within the natural hair community over the issues of whether hair typing is beneficial to the community and should be the standard. But I don’t believe there are divisions within the community as the author suggests is demonstrated through the difference in views of Youtube videos between textures. People seem to forget there are many people of different races and ethnicities who have similar textures to 3a African Americans and choosing to embrace their curls and are watching our videos as well, especially tweens and teens.
AIthough there is a part of the community that admires more loose curly textures, I believe that is a personal issue they have to resolve for themselves. They can choose to love and embrace their hair as is or get discouraged that it isn’t a 3a and go back to creamy crack or other checmical treatment. It’s sad if they make that choice, but that is THEIR personal choice. And we have to stop policing & judging those who do. The truth is there are many people who never learn to love themselves inside and out. It is sad, but you can always choose to be a source of encouragement. Also remember actions speak louder than words. More people are becoming natural not from what they hear but because of the results they have seen in the hair of naturals.
Sorry for the book, but this topic really struck a chord with me.
“We have to stop policing and judging those who do…” Yes! Yes! Yes! Right on. This has been a struggle for me to not show my sour face when girlfriends of mine have gone back to relaxers. They have made the choice that’s right for them. I need to support that.
<3
The amounts of likes in each photo can possibly be the result of many variables. For example; one has more followers/views than the other, or hair length preferences. I don’t think we should assume that the amount of likes are based solely on the hair texture. Like someone mentioned, how can we even know the true texture of their hair when both hair styles are manipulated?
While I don’t think hair typing is necessary, the hair typing system itself is not the issue. It’s how people choose to use the system. I can see how it can help in terms being a guide to finding certain products to achieve a certain outcome etc. The division is caused by people and the way they choose to perceive things.
I think discrimination in the natural hair community is in two parts. The first part is texture, the hair types that curl easily are preferred. The longer hair regardless of texture is preferred.
Hi!
I’ve wondered the same thing…
Just so you know, I’m a 3C/4A not that this means anything except that I have loopy spirals for curls vs. a more zig zag wave like my mother’s hair. I went natural about Mmmmmm, six or seven years ago (*wow*) and, like Kelsey, I felt for the time that knowing that type helped me get acquainted in the natural hair universe. When I looked at the models rocking the tight twist outs like our model to the right I really wanted to snap up that look. But couldn’t. It’s just not a possibility for me and my hair.
Knowing 3c/4a was a big deal. I knew to steer away from heavier products and heavier oils; my coils are just not as tight hence oil dispenses over the strand a little easier than, say, my mum’s hair. Keep it light, creamy and not too oily and condition, condition, condition and I was good to go.
But when you’re venturing back to the whole new world of your natural roots, this is just a beginning.
Why?
Because the first thing we’re wondering is “what are cute styles I can rock?” and thinking less “how do I take care of this?” Which makes sense because you’re going to need to walk out the house into the public view not looking crazy way before your hair will ever show signs of breakage or dryness.
When it comes to caring for my hair and long term growth, the most important things for me to know have been 1. How oily my scalp is (very) 2. What sort of thickness my individual strands are (fine…which is also why twist outs don’t work for me) 3. What sort of hair care temperament do I have (short short fuse, lol, give me wash n go or give me a root canal.)
And more and more great natural hair products are appearing in stores! And natural hair models! …but why…oh why…do most of them have 3c/4a hair? Because when I see the other beautiful naturals rocking it out round town, my hair texture is much much less common. Could it be there’s some lingering colonialism even in our naturalness?
I asked my partner what he thought. Apparently, I wasn’t the only person who’d noticed this. Pretty much only one kind of natural gets representation. And when you see anyone else, it’s limited, or styled to look more like a 3c/4a. Hmmmmm.
So Kelsey, I’m feelin’ ya. Completely. And I too have noticed other women of color look at my hair and ponder going natural but voice a fear of the 4c. I think it’s gorgeous, but maybe they don’t feel so secure in this? It’s a big jump to go from stick straight chemically treated hair for most of your life to full out African gorgeous. No matter how good you look, you’re just not used to it.
But what can we do about this? How can we reduce the texture definition to just numbers that are a starting point?
I think we undervalue the power we have as women of color to divinely nurture each other. I think it begins here. I think it begins with reaching across the board and praising other naturals ESPECIALLY when they’ve luckily got the Fabulous 4c texture. I think it comes with spending as much time talking about our scalp and the thickness/coarseness of our strands and not just generalizations on their coil pattern.
I don’t know. These are just some ideas. What say the rest of you?
Love!!
Personally i think both look beautiful. I would like both and share them even though my hair texture is different. Its the style that matters the most. Maybe the picture is not about hair discrimination. Maybe its about aspiring to have something you don’t have and appreciating it. Humans will always want something that is slightly out of their reach. So instead of starting a debate about hair hierarchy we should just appreciate our differences and celebrate it. I really believe we should go forward not backwards. We have come along way!!
It always helps to have many references and examples. In the beginning of my journey I hardly found many examples of natural hair similar to my own. I have type 4 hair and was always putting so much effort into defining and getting my hair to clump and curl, hoping to get that type 3 look. It also didn’t help that even though I consider myself black, people in my community would point out that I am mixed, and question the texture and nature of my hair and my decision to go natural in the first place. “When are you going to DO your hair?” “You look better with your hair STRAIGHTER.” “But your GRANDPARENTS don’t have hair like that.” “NATURAL HAIR doesn’t go with you.” Pretty much people were trying to tell me I had “bad hair” that was some kind of defect. What helped me out was doing my best to limit my social media exposure to women who had a similar hair type to mine. No more spending countless hours lusting over hair that I clearly did not have. No more wishing and hoping to have “Tracy Ellis Ross” hair and wasting money on hair products to “control and tame” my hair. The more I saw type 4, the more I accepted it, and the more I accepted myself for having it. I stopped trying to get my hair to behave like type 3 and started allowing my hair to just do what it does, in it’s own unique way. I love all hair types, but for me, learning to “discriminate” in a positive way by finding others to relate to helped me so much. Now that it’s been years since my big chop and I just hit WL, I hear “Your hair is LONG because you’re MIXED.” I’m like, “No honey, my hair is long because I learned to LOVE and NURTURE the hair that my AFRICAN ancestors gave me.” It took me a long, long time, but I today I am glad to say that I really do love my hair, kinks and all, despite what society may try to pressure me into. Stop waiting for society to “like” your hair, and learn to love it no matter what your texture may be. People can say whatever they want about how our hair “should” look, or what is “acceptable”, but it’s up to us not to accept what they say as the truth.
I suspect most people who go natural hope they have type 3 hair. It comes closer to what many consider ‘mainstream beauty’ and appears to be easier to manage.
*sigh* Let’s try this again…
There is nothing wrong with hair typing and classifications when they are being used from an OBJECTIVE standpoint. The problem comes when 1) SUBJECTIVE judgements are placed on certain types and categories and 2) people are unwilling or unable to let go of those subjective positions, whether they’re applying them to their own hair or to others’.
Hair typing is meant to be a MEANS to an end, not the end itself. It lets you know that hey, new natural, these women (let’s call them group X) have a hair texture that’s similar to yours, and here’s what they can and can’t do. These women (let’s call them group Y) have a hair texture that’s different from yours, and here’s what THEY can and can’t do. When embarking on this journey, you might want to start with group X’s methods because they’re less likely to cause as much frustration. However, THERE’S NO RULE saying you can’t try a method from group Y because really — really! — the only true rules are those that work for you and your hair. Over time you will understand that the only true hair type is YOUR hair type, whatever that is. Until then, though, feel feel to sample from ALL OF THE GROUPS to see what works for you.
See? That wasn’t complicated, was it?
Keeping it real: Too many black folks are still so stuck on this good/bad hair bullsh** that it’s impossible for them not to transfer that to hair typing. Hey, guess what? The one-drop rule is bullsh** too. Welcome to the 21st Century. Can we let go of the bullsh** we were taught, use the brains God gave us, and evolve into self-loving beings?
(Sorry if my sarcasm offends; I’m just getting impatient while I wait for the revolution to happen. In my LIFETIME, maybe? Please??)
LBell, on point per usual. I personally grow rather tired of the texture discrimination conversation, and I typically only bring up “typing” unless someone asks. In truth, I just don’t care that much. You are 137% spot on in the objective vs subjective classification. Hair typing is a tool, not a hierarchical structure. You hit the nail right on the head — we’ve dragged that good/bad hair conversation over to natural hair. Not only does it stem from a history of having European standards of beauty imposed on us, it is also rooted in our limited comprehension of things beyond a basic dichotomy. Things have to be good or bad, black or white, short or long, big or small.
as for that dichotomy of polar opposites, i blame european language and culture for that. they don’t have a concept of “gray”, and they transferred that very limited thinking onto the rest of the world. the real free peoples.
Well said on all points, LBell! If it isn’t our lifetime (*sigh*), maybe the next generation will get over this hump. I hate thinking that though, because I feel like my parent’s generation thought the same thing when when they were my age about other issues that face our community.
sorry no revolution…never…we had the opportunity and squander it
1.This is correlation without causation at its finest. How do you know one didn’t receive more or less likes simply because one recieved more or less views. I can’t like a video I’ve never seen even if I would like it if I’d seen it.
2. How can texture discrimination be the cause when you can’t see either ladies true texture? When you put two pics/video side by side like this it makes it easier to critic the small details of the style and I would like the one on the left before the one on the right. Their texture has nothing to do with it because you can’t see their true texture in a twistout.
3. Narcissism at it’s finest, IMHO. It’s the I deserve mentality and when people don’t get it (in this case thumbs up/likes) they try to come up with a reason to justify why they aren’t getting what they believe they obviously should be….in this it must be texture discrimination. Social media has created this monster out of craving attention and the monster has to be fed regularly otherwise someone feels slighted.
Maybe one got more or less like because of picture quality, posters personality (which we all know people like vides of people they like even when the style isn’t even that good), or maybe that poster used technique or combination of technique and products that simply resulted in a better twistout than the next posters. No shade in that. One just looks better than the other.
this is so sad.. so true..and painful to read, the self-hated has been so ingrained in us its going to take time for it to get better, personally i don’t watch natural hair tutorials if her hair is not similar to miness..I dislike the hair typing chart. it hasn’t been a help to me.. I see the division.. I am hoping it gets better.
I haven’t experienced any discrimination, but my friends who have a much less kinky texture than I don’t seem to understand when I say that my hair is work. I guess if I had to say a type, I’d say I’m a 4c and I just cannot wash and go like some of my friends can. They insist on arguing with me by saying yes I can. The truth is I cannot. They don’t see me working on my hair. Where they can just add water and get a curl, I must add product and manipulate my hair to achieve similar results. And they don’t understand that when I say that, I am not knocking my natural hair. I’m only pointing out my reality.
I meant to thumbs up. Silly phone! Sorry.
I don’t understand comments like this. What makes our 4b/c texture more work? I can add some water and gel to my 4c hair and call it a day just as your friends if I wanted to. The out come will be the same- Your hair ‘s true texture presented as is. No it won’t just curl up into little ringlets. Lol why would it? Better question is why would I want it to? You don’t HAVE to sit there and manipulate your hair into twist out/ braid outs, you are CHOOSING to take a more complicated route. A big difference. When we with kinky coil nappy hair keep describing our our hair as “work”, “difficult to maintain”, “Bushed out and frizzy” we will continue to have issues. We can all take tips, hair styles and care advice from each other no matter the texture.The key is knowing YOUR hair, not the category that it falls in on some hair chart. Stop putting limitations on yourself and stop grabbing hold to what someone says are don’ts for their hair and making them your own. I’ve been natural since I was 16( no wigs, weaves or hot comb) now 30 and I have tried everything with my hair. I didn’t even know that I wasn’t suppose to not do wash n gos on my naps or that my 45 minute wash days were unusual. It was when I started watching Youtube that I realized that many naturals have too many hang ups about their texture.
@JennieD I don’t think you can really judge that person for saying it takes more effort to do her hair, nor do I think it’s self-hate or whatever people imply. It’s a fact that straight hair detangles easily, and my own 3c hair takes effort in comparison, and my sister’s 4b/c hair takes even more because it tangles as you detangle. It’s not about putting her hair into ringlets or whatever, the issue but the amount of care needed to insure it’s healthy. Today I was putting her hair into a simple ponytail and had to put more product than I would have to on my own. I don’t think that puts any less value to her hair, in fact I think her hair is beautiful (and why thicker than my own which I am extremely jealous of), but it takes effort, and there is NO problem with that.
I’m not judging I’m just saying hair can become “work” if you make it that way. All styles take effort but it shouldn’t be seen as work. That makes it sound like a part time job. The amount of care to keep any hair healthy is actually minimal for any hair type. Hair is dead you can only try to preserve it as much as you can. Since you gave the example of the simple pony tail for your sister, I ask if it took a lot of effort and more product just to get her hair in a smooth pony tail why not choose another style that required less effort and product? You see where I’m going? A pony tail for my 4b/c hair isn’t always a wise choice unless I have my hair stretched a bit. If there is shrinkage I don’t bother cause all that tugging and pulling to get it back into a pony tail isn’t healthy for the hair and scalp. My point is we have options and can have an easy time with our hair if we choose to.
Straight hair does not always detangle easily have ever tried to detangle matted or very tangled straight hair?
I did and i could not detangle it. So it depends on the person.
You
This is 100% true. Naturals need to stop saying their hair is so much work…
That’s cool that you don’t understand. We obviously have different experiences. And I never said I had an issue with the fact that it’s work. I simply said it is work. And I said so because it is. I wore a perm for years and found that to be much less maintenance on my hair. I know others who cannot say the same. As I said, I cannot put water and gel in my hair and go. And I don’t say this because I expect it to become curly and coiled, but because water alone will seem good while wet, and once it’s dry I will have something else on my hands. It just doesn’t work for me. Again, that’s just my experience. So twisting and manipulating my hair tends to work better for me. You don’t have to understand, as it’s not your hair. But you don’t have to knock it either.
Me being a “4c” hair rocker have dealt with this many times its sad. Think about it blacks have FINALLY embraced their natural side and arent trying to look like someone else then someone decides that the closer the hair looks to straight the better so it’s like we embraced it but really didnt cause now we are trying to fit in this example of the people who said are hair was too nappy in the first place. BLACKS took two steps forward and one step back with the natural hair movement. Luckily you have bloggers that rock their kinkier textures with pride and make others who have it not feel the heat from European standards.
I think this is 1/10th of what is actually going on here. Sure, you could say people only shared the photo because of hair typing–but it could also be length bias, skin tone discrimination, the color of the hair ETC., ETC.,
People don’t typically share images more or less because of the caption below. They share because they are biased towards some images rather than others. I bet if you did a legitimate experiment without caption, the result would have been the same.
Exactly. There could be a millions reason why one pic/video gets more like than the other and without legitimate experiments being done it’s just speculation and projection.
I agree with you that the author’s opinion does not equate to a legitimate experiment , however, call it common sense or experience but I believe the combination of the things you listed ‘…length bias, skin tone discrimination, the color of the hair’ is the reason one image has more likes/shares than the other. I think whether we realize it or not a lot of us unconsciously prefer the image that is closest to the european standard of beauty; the standard that we see daily especially among famous black females and that is constantly marketed to us even in advertisements where black females are the target audience.
This is just my opinion, not fact.
I agree. I don’t think it’s wise to look at this issue in isolation. There are other factors that come into play.
agreed…Also, variables like the number of followers each lady has, how many times they shared the photos on their social media, etc. has been glossed over. When it comes to likes/shares marketing is a factor, not just the photo. There is also that the woman on the left has a full face of make-up and is obviously showing more than just the hair & we can’t quite see the face of the woman on the right. Sure, curl bias & discrimination may exist but comparing the sharing/likes of these two photos doesn’t make a case for it.
some of these recent articles seem forced, for lack of a better word. It was so short and really didn’t say anything in my opinion.
Yes, a regurgitation of a lot of information widely known seems to be the direction most of these new articles are heading.
Pity, I used to look forward to catching up on the latest in the natural hair world.